Fr Franz Magnis-Suseno (IDO) was born as Count von Magnis in 1936 in Silesia, Germany. In 1955 he became a Jesuit priest and later went to Indonesia, where he still lives and works as a priest and university professor. In 1997 Father Magnis-Suseno, who studied theology, philosophy and politics and had by then obtained a doctorate in theology, took out citizenship in his adopted country and chose the additional Javanese name of Suseno. In 2001 he was awarded the Commander’s Cross of the Order of Merit of the Federal Republic of Germany. He was interviewed in early January by representatives of the international Catholic charity Aid to the Church in Need (ACN).
An interview with Father Franz Magnis-Suseno
Q) Father Suseno, you have been living in Indonesia now for half a century. What is it that constitutes the attraction of this country for you?
A) Its interesting and friendly people. In almost 50 years in Indonesia I cannot recall a single occasion when I felt offended by the way in which the Indonesians reacted to me. It is a wonderful country. And to be privileged to share in the process in which the country, and above all its intellectuals, are working through the gravest of crises towards a more humane and dignified future is a source of deep satisfaction to me. And the fact that I am fully accepted as an Indonesian makes it so much more beautiful still for me. A special attraction for me has been and still is the Javanese people, who at 40% make up the largest group in Indonesia. Their cultivated, never intrusive, but dependable friendship, borne on the wings of a great culture, has to this day never lost its charm for me.
Q) You have become an Indonesian citizen. What led you to take this step?
A) I came here as a missionary because I wanted to help the Church in Indonesia. There were already other German Jesuits in Indonesia whose accounts had impressed me. Right from the beginning I wanted to stay in Indonesia. Once I had got over my initial culture shock and discovered that I apparently did not get too much on the nerves of the Indonesians and that I too did not have to become a stranger to myself – and since my ecclesiastical superiors also hoped that I would remain in Indonesia – I took steps to take out Indonesian citizenship as soon as possible. I finally obtained this in 1977, and took out the additional Javanese name of Suseno.
Q) You have directly witnessed recent Indonesian history. The country has changed and developed. How do you see this development?
A) Indonesia, like many other countries of Asia, is developing rapidly from a traditional to a modern society, conditioned by tough competition and pressure to succeed. Not surprisingly, Indonesia has gone through phases of euphoria, interspersed at times with terrible tragedy. But the direction has always been upwards. Without question, people are much better off today than they were 50 years ago. The Indonesians have learned from their history. And Indonesia has remained open and tolerant. That makes me feel moderately optimistic for the future of the country.
Q) You have taught at the “Driyarkara School of Philosophy”. What is the objective of this foundation? To what extent does the philosophical thinking of your new country differ from that of your old one?
A) On the one hand, this university that I have helped to establish is there to provide our young Jesuits, together with the seminarians of the Archdiocese of Jakarta and of a number of religious orders, including the Franciscans, with the first, philosophical part of their canonical studies. But right from the start the university has also been open to lay students of all religions. Around 15% of the students are Muslims. Through their interest they make an important contribution to the quality of our academic life. Our philosophy is not “Indonesian” but is interested in the international development of philosophy. It is however Indonesian in the sense that such disciplines as philosophical anthropology, ethics, political philosophy, epistemology, natural theology are strongly linked to intellectual dialogue and an awareness of the problems. For us lecturers it is always nice to know that in the student evaluations, conducted at the end of every semester, it is silly these core philosophical subjects that are almost without exception given a high rating for their relevance. Even years after they have left university, students again and again assure me that the university has made a decisive contribution to their own intellectual development.
Q) How is Christianity perceived by your non-Christian countrymen? Do they see it as an enrichment for Indonesia?
A) They see us as partners in the effort to help the people of Indonesia to a better future. We are united in our commitment for social justice, democracy, human rights, in our sharp criticism of corruption and violence, and our commitment to religious tolerance.
Q) How do you see the situation of the religious minorities, in particular that of the Catholic Christians in Indonesia?
A) We have two contrary tendencies. On the one hand, we Christians, and above all the Catholics, have never had such good personal relations with the most important leaders of the Muslims as we do today. Many of our seminarians, and also our religious sisters undertake one or more practical stages of their training in Islamic schools. The state policy of Pancasila – the core of which is that of national consensus, the idea that Indonesia belongs to all Indonesians without giving the majority religion (Islam, at 88% of the population) any kind of special status – is not in question. But in certain regions, for example in West Java, there has been a growth of intolerance at the grass roots, stirred up by extremists, that makes it difficult for us, for example, to build new churches. Those who are completely defenceless are the Islamic sects, for example the Ahmadiyah community. Here, for reasons of opportunism, the state is not fulfilling its duty to protect all its citizens and guarantee them their human rights. Some 95% of all the Christian communities can hold their religious services without any hindrance at all. Conversion to another religion is possible, and does indeed take place, including from Islam to Christianity.
Q) In recent months the media have reported on an increase in attacks against Christian communities, and other infringements of religious freedom. What is your assessment of these events? Do they indicate a trend?
A) This development is not so new. It began 20 years ago, when then President Suharto turned to Islam for political reasons. Since then over 1000 churches have been attacked. The democratisation of the country, following the fall of Suharto in 1998, made it possible for the Islamic extremists to emerge openly. In over 100 districts sharia based legislation has been introduced. But as I have said, the great majority of Christians enjoy complete freedom. So far as I know, there is no other comparable country in which the situation is so favourable. I myself suspect that the Christian minority will have to adjust to the fact that Indonesia will become more Islamic. But, providing the economic development continues to move forward positively, Indonesia will, I believe, remain a democracy in which human rights, and specifically religious freedom, will be guaranteed and to 95 % realised. The reports in the media create a much more serious impression than the reality.
Q) What does “evangelisation” actually mean in Indonesia; in other words, what form should it take?
A) Evangelisation does not mean persuading as many people as possible to become baptised – although we should rejoice at every person who does in fact receive baptism – in Indonesia it is after at least one year of the catechumenate. Evangelisation means bearing witness to the spirit of the Gospel – in other words the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Jesus, of love – and making this a reality in Indonesian society. Our Christian communities should bear witness to the power, beauty and joy that is bestowed on us by our following Jesus. People should be able to sense that Jesus makes all things whole and holy. We should convey this spirit to others, and for our part allow ourselves to be inspired and enriched by our non-Christian Indonesian sisters and brothers.
Q) What should charities like ACN do for Christians in Indonesia?
A) They can help in all kinds of ways to strengthen the structures that the Church in Indonesia needs in order to bear witness. In so doing, the charitable agencies help to encourage our communities.
Q) What role should Christians play in the efforts to promote dialogue and reconciliation?
A) A very great role. Above all between Catholics and Muslims there is a constant ongoing dialogue. This is not a matter of the direct content of our faith, however. As far as that is concerned, we must mutually accept our differences. All religions are not equal. But the decisive issue of a coexistence that guarantees the dignity of all people in Indonesia and above all helps the poor, the disadvantaged and the politically estranged, has been the constant object of our quite intensive communication. Reconciliation in Indonesia has a historical dimension, it must be said. Again and again – with a peak in 1965/1966 – there have been terrible conflicts, clashes, massacres and discrimination. I believe that I can say that the Churches have already and for many years now been making a special contribution here, and continue to do so still.
Source: ACN News – Interview: Thursday, 20th January 2011 – INDONESIA